About This Episode

Michelle Palmer, AMP Vice President of Technical Services and Compliance, and Ed Krieger, Assistant Administrator for the City of Columbus Division of Power and the Chair of AMP’s Member Services Training Task Force, join The Public Power Line to discuss the importance of lineworker training and the growth of AMP’s training program.

Transcription

The Public Power Line – S1E1
The Importance of Lineworker Training

Tracy Reimbold: Public Power Systems are the heartbeat of a community, powering the homes, businesses and schools across the country. But do you know all that goes into operating a public power system? So, whether you’re an AMP Member, employee or partner organization, or you’re simply passionate about the energy that powers our towns and cities, we invite you to plug in and listen to this podcast where we explore the topics and issues most important to AMP Members and public power. This is The Public Power Line. I’m your host. Traci Reinbold with American Municipal Power, the nonprofit wholesale power and services provider for more than 130 public power communities across nine states. In this episode, we’ll be discussing lineworker training and the growth of AMP’s training program.

For today’s discussion, we are joined by Michelle Palmer, AMP’s Vice President of Technical Services and Compliance, and Ed Krieger, Assistant Administrator for the City of Columbus Division of Power and the Chair of AMP’s Member Services Training Task Force. Prior to his current role with the City of Columbus, Ed was the Director of Piqua Power System, where he worked for almost 27 years. He is a member of the American Public Power Association Board of Directors and a former member of the AMP Board of Trustees. Michelle and Ed, thank you so much for joining us today.

You’re both very strong proponents for a good line worker training. Michelle, I’d like to start with you. Could you share from your experience why you feel lineworker training is so important, what makes a training program exceptional and what training opportunities are available through AMP’s program?

Michelle Palmer: Yeah, so training provides the opportunity to improve and gain skills as well as increase knowledge. In my opinion, it is an investment in employees. AMP’s training program combines the necessary classroom activities with the practical hands on in both a lab type setting as well as field exposure, and we put place a strong emphasis on safety and adherence to the APPA Safety Manual. All activities that we perform in class mirror the types of activities that would be performed by the trainees back at their home utility with the goal to maintain a safe and reliable power system. Our current apprenticeship consists of two weeks of training per year, and we combine that with the correspondence coursework that each of them is required to complete. And then, students apply all of those skills that they’ve learned back at their home utility and, you know, so a total apprenticeship, it consists of 8,000 hours of the on the job work that they do, as well as the 600 hours of book work and more than 130 hours of training here at AMP.

Reimbold: Thank you, Ed, do you have anything you’d like to add?

Ed Krieger: From my perspective, all the things that Michelle talked about to go into building a journeyman lineman over a period of years, as utility managers, you know, a well-trained, dedicated employee that has experience is really our silver bullet — they make our jobs easier. So, you know, when you look at lineworker training, you can’t really talk about an electric utility and operating an electric utility without well trained lineworker group. And I feel like there’s the major components — and we’ve kind of been following that since I started in Piqua back in 98. We actually had a pretty decent program started there already. What we lacked was the off-site training component.

As a manager, I just felt like getting our employees out networking with other employees, talking about how they do their jobs, felt like it was really important. And it was also important for them to kind of weigh in with, you know, employees from other utilities that are kind of the same place that they are, and kind of see where they’re at. And, so, I know when I left last November and came over to City of Columbus, we had plans to, you know, enroll our City of Piqua apprentices into the AMP program. You know, we’re, we’re deep into it over here in the city of Columbus. We’ve got 19 employees that are in one-to-two-year or zero-to-two-years experience. We’ve got our first group that’s going to be looking to.

Complete the program sometime next year. We have eight employees there — they’re more seasoned employees. I think lots of times, in some of our utilities, we don’t, maybe don’t do a good job in terms of reinforcing with our employees that, “hey, you’re doing well, you’re ahead of where you should be,” and by doing this of-site training — and now we have the opportunity to do it through AMP’s program as well — you know, they can talk to Members from other communities and see where they’re at, and see, see if they’re where they should be. So, you know, I feel like that’s really important. The Northwest Lineman training components a big piece of it. And I guess, you know, one other thing I just would like to add, in terms of what I think makes a really valuable component of a lineworker training program is the opportunity to participate in mutual aid. We were always a big proponent of that where I worked before. You know, it’s important to help other communities that are in need, and it’s also a great opportunity for employees to get out and, in a really short amount of time, respond in these emergencies. Whether it’s hurricanes and Florida, ice storms in Kentucky, they build skills and they talk to and work with other cities. And so, those are all good things, and I think you know, ideally, if you could, if you could add all those things into your training program, I think that’ll help you get where you want to be.

Reimbold: For many communities — especially smaller communities — making big investments requires the Member to budget for such training and manage the resources, since training requires a financial investment as well as employee hours. Ed, from your experience working in AMP Member communities and as Chair of AMP’s Member Service Training Task Force, can you talk about why training is such an important investment to make, and what might you say to a community on the fence about it?

Krieger: You know, a well-trained staff is going to be your best friend, and it’s going to be your community’s best friend. And I can’t say enough how important it is to have well-trained, experienced, dedicated and caring employees. It just makes things go so much better. Anyone that has been in a position where you have a lot of young employees, you know it’s not easy. And I know some of our smaller communities, they’re resource limited — they don’t have as many employees — so all the more reason to lean into training. I know during my time at Piqua, we had 25 employees through the certification process, and for different reasons, you’re going to lose employees. And at first, it’s kind of tough, but I finally reached the point to where I realized that that’s just the fact of life. A lot of times you can’t control them, and so, as a utility manager, utility staff, you know, if you’re charged with providing this service, you just got to realize you’re going to be in this training business as long as you’re managing a utility. You’re going to continue to be training employees. And we talk about investments, it’s not just–yeah, there’s an investment. You know, there’s fees for completing the training modules over at AMP, but, you know, there’s a bigger investment in what you do with your trainees. You just can’t have them go through the bookwork at Northwest Lineman College — although that’s great — you just can’t send them over to AMP. You know, the most important thing is what they do when they get back home, and ensuring that there’s an environment where they can grow, that you have some experienced employees that can help them grow, that you’re promoting employees to those leadership positions, that those people enjoy training, because a very important part of the job is training new staff. You know, for the smaller Members, that can be a challenge, and I just would encourage the smaller communities to lean on their neighbors, lean on AMP staff, lean on the larger communities that surround them. You know, there’s nothing that makes me happier than to be able to help other AMP Members that maybe don’t have the resources that we’d had in Piqua here in Columbus. To me, it’s–you have to train, it’s not a question of if you train. And so, if you’re going to do it, hopefully you lean into it, you commit to it, and you do it the right way.

Palmer: You know, Ed mentioned networking a bit ago, and networking, I think, is really important for the small Members, and training provides a good opportunity for them to interact with, sometimes their neighbors, sometimes folks from other states, and it really exposes, not just a small Member, but anyone attending training, the opportunity to learn, maybe a different way that things get done between communities. You know, ideas are shared and information is taken back, and I know that they take those network contacts and that they reach out to each other after they leave our training class.

Reimbold: You have both worked extensively to improve AMP’s, lineworker training program. Can you tell me a little about your experience with the program, and it’s importance to Members,

Palmer: You know, so the training program, I mean, it’s been around, it’s been around for a while. We’ve made a lot of improvements. Our training staff, headed by Scott McKenzie, you know, they’ve worked really, really hard to implement any of the suggestions that Members have. And we really feel that, you know, we’re able to kind of customize the program to kind of match the skills that the folks that are coming, and I think that, I think that’s, that’s a really important, important piece.

Krieger: Yeah, that’s a difficult one for you, Michelle, is tailoring it. Like I said, all the Members are not created equal.

Palmer: Yeah, that’s exactly right. It’s for that reason that we try to keep that low instructor-to-student ratio. We want to make sure we provide the opportunities for one on one when it’s needed. And, you know, breaking the trainees into small groups, it helps to simulate the way that they would be operating back at their home utility. So, we think that all of those things are important to make sure that every student gains an understanding of whatever individual topic it is that that’s being discussed at the time, and we’re available to take questions throughout the year, which I think is one of the unique aspects of our training program, is that, you know, if there’s the students, get all of the instructors contact information. So, if there’s a question that they have in their bookwork, or they have a question, safety concern, the general safety folks that are coming out and providing that, that training on a quarterly basis to our Members, they are in class with the students. And so it’s, you know, we’re helping to make those relationships last. , you know, it carries them, carries them through. You know, whether they’re in class with us or they’re not

Reimbold: Ed, do you have anything you’d like to add?

Krieger: So, from my perspective, I started with the City of Piqua as Assistant Director back in 98, and they had shut the city’s coal-fired power plant down in 96, and as part of that, you know, some of the employees had to find new job opportunities and you know, no one was let go. So, then I had to kind of determine and work to identify, you know, what’s the best way to train our employees? That’s when I decided it was really kind of important to add a significant off-site training component and we decided to send our employees to Decatur, Illinois, which was a pretty good drive for the employees. And we kind of were going along that way for a period of time, and in the meantime, you know, there’s a lot of–been a lot of really positive changes in the AMP lineworker training program. And, you know, I always wanted for all AMP Members, if possible, to train through AMP’s lineworker training program, but at the same time, I wanted to make sure it was it provide the experiences that we needed for our employees growth. And so, you know, I’m just really excited with where we’re at with the program. It’s come a long, long way. And, you know, like anything, you know, the credit for that goes to the leadership of the team, in terms of Michelle and Scott and really all the team members. I mean, great group of trainers — and Michelle, you’re going to have to jump in here and name everybody that’s involved with that, because I’m sure I’m going to forget things, but you know, always remember yourself and Jennifer and Scott, and you have, obviously, Bob’s there, but now you have Chad and his group that’s doing the circuit rider and also training and so, and Brandon as well. So, and I’m sure I’m missing someone, but uh.

Palmer: Yep, Brandon and Ryan. Jim Everly comes and helps, as well as Doug Sturgeon and Scott Simmerly.

Krieger: Yeah, great, great group and, and that’s really those, all that whole team is what’s elevated the level of professionalism and really the product — what we need to grow our employees in all of our Member communities. So, yeah, I’m excited for the future.

Palmer: Yeah, we’ve, we’ve really built off of a lot of the work from Ed from other members of the Training Task Force. And, you know, I mentioned before that, we try to keep students into small groups, but we understand that the folks coming to us, like everybody learns a little differently, right? That’s part of the reason that we have the classroom, the lab space and then the field, just to try and make sure that we’re hitting whatever learning style it is that a student has, so that they can take something away.

Reimbold: In 2023 the U.S. Department of Labor (DOL) approved AMP’s lineworker training program as a registered apprenticeship sponsor. AMP recently honored 21 lineworkers from AMP and Member communities who achieved the DOL certification. Michelle, can you talk about this? How much effort went into acquiring this achievement, what it means for lineworkers and AMP’s footprint and why it is such an important distinction.

Palmer: So this was what I will term a labor of love, because I think it took us three to four years before we were able to get our program certified, and a lot of it was, you know, back and forth with the Ohio State Apprenticeship Council, who serves as our entity. But one of the things that was super important for us as an organization, we’re not just Ohio based, so we wanted to make sure that whatever program that we put forth, that Ohio was going to be able to certify, you know, everyone through that U.S. Department of Labor, and we were able to achieve that.

We just feel that it’s really an important, it’s, it’s a really important step to have a structured apprenticeship program. You know, a lot of trades have their own apprenticeship, and it defines what is going to be included in the apprenticeship and the types of activities that have to be accomplished in order to receive the certification. And, you know, it’s a, it’s a big commitment when you enter a trade, and the DOL certification is a recognition of that.

Ed, I don’t know if you have any, any comments on, on the importance of that.

Krieger: Oh, yeah. Definitely. I have to give it to my predecessor at City of Piqua, Dick Miller. Dick had done the groundwork on this thing years ago, and we trained employees using this DOL certification structure. We–we’ve built employees that can work anywhere, and uh, we started, in Piqua, we called it hashtag Piqua trained. You know is it was we felt like we could train employees as well as anyone. And this DOL certification really provides you the structure and the process to build a training program back home that allows you to really develop experience, skilled, safe employees that, uh, you know, you’ll reap the benefit of that for many years. When, when your phone doesn’t ring at three in the morning because they’re getting up and taking care of things, that’s a good feeling. So yeah, this, this has been a major accomplishment, and I’m looking forward to AMP adding additional job series to this to the benefit of all our communities.

Reimbold: So with the approval of the Board, AMP has been planning an expansion of its lineworker training facility, which is getting underway in the summer of 2025. You were both involved in that process, advocating for its approval.

First, Michelle, can you provide an update on what the expansion involves, what can Members expect once it’s complete, and what this means for AMP’s training program?

And then, Ed, you were a big proponent and champion of this project. Can you talk about why you felt this was so important and how this will help Members in training their lineworkers going into the future, as changes continue to take place in that career field and in the industry.

Palmer: The new facility is going to be roughly 8,000 square feet. Once, you know, the building is physically constructed, our training staff will need to go in and start building out some of the lab spaces. That’s one of the things that we’ll be adding to the space, is expansion of the lab. And the most exciting piece is that the building will be tall enough and contain an indoor climbing area, so we’ll have poles set inside, which will allow us to be a year-round training center. It’s super exciting to even think about the fact that we’ll be able to have classes when the weather is not so great outside. We’re excited about the opportunities to have folks in and really spread the training out. That was one of the things that we heard from Members, was “all of our apprentice classes, all of our training is during the prime construction months. Can’t you spread it out?” And you know, by adding this facility, that’s going to allow us to spread it out.

Krieger: Yeah, I was a long time Board member, you know, I’m still a Committee member now, but I worked most of my career and been exposed to the operation side. You know, I think the Board, to some extent, that experience doesn’t really exist a lot of times, when you’re looking at city managers, village managers, they just haven’t had the opportunity to spend a lot of time in that area. So, you know, I always felt like it was my job to bring things or advocate for things that I think would be valuable, not only for Piqua, but really for the AMP membership as a whole. You know, I felt like, you know, let’s move this lineworker training program as far as we can move it. And you know, if we’re going to ask our dedicated AMP training team to provide this service. It’s our job as a Board, as a Member, to help provide and advocate for the resources that they really need to do the best job that they can do. You know, that’s personnel, equipment, it’s inventory, and really where we were falling short was our facility.

But at this point, we’ve done as much as we can do with the existing facility. So to take our training process and experience to the same level as those that are providing it, either in the investor-owned world or at the co-ops, and so we need to have comparable facilities. So, you know, if you don’t have the facilities and the resources to get the job done, that’s really the starting point, and then you have to execute the vision. So, I’m excited where we’re at, I’m excited where we’re going, it’s going to be a whole different training experience next year, and I’m excited about, let’s add some more job series as well. So, you know, we’ve talked about metering and substations, and maybe, you know, downtown networks like we have in Columbus. You know, those are unique skills as well. So, and the opportunity to train year round and expand our training calendar, especially as we get more and more enrollees. Yeah, I’m excited for the changes and looking forward to what it can do to help move all our Members forward and build experience knowledgeable employees to help our Members accomplish their goals.

Reimbold: Thank you to Michelle and Ed for joining us today and sharing your insights on lineworker training.

Palmer: Thanks for having us.

Krieger: Appreciate it. Thanks for the time.

Reimbold: I’m Tracy Reinhold, your host for The Public Power Line, where we explore the topics and issues most important to AMP Members and public power. If you like what you’ve heard on The Public Power Line podcast, please share it and subscribe so you don’t miss future episodes. Search for The Public Power Line wherever you get your podcast. This podcast is produced by Zachary Hoffman, AMP’s Manager of Communications and Publications. If you have ideas for future podcasts, please reach out to AMP’s Communications Team at [email protected].